ABC 7:30 Christine Milne interview 

http://tinyurl.com/cw6jtxs

Transcript: 27.06.2012 

Greens leader Senator Christine Milne on 7:30

LEIGH SALES, PRESENTER: Now, pretty much whatever passes through the House of Representatives, the Greens have said today, as Chris just explained they will stymie it in the Senate and to discuss that I'm joined now by the Greens' leader Christine Milne in Canberra.

Christine Milne, let me just check with you does Andrew Wilkie's amendment, the imposition of this 12 month sunset clause change your mind at all?

CHRISTINE MILNE, GREENS LEADER: No, it doesn't, Leigh. We will be supporting the sunset clause because we don't believe offshore processing is appropriate, it's inconsistent with the refugee convention.

So ending this proposal is better than just having an open ended debate but we will be opposing this legislation put forward by Rob Oakeshott because it's even worse than what the Government proposed in the first place because it's removing any kind of protections in the legislation that was there and it's basically saying that asylum seekers can be sent to any of the signatories to the Bali process and that includes Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria - it really is no protections sending people out of sight out of mind. It is actually a major step backwards.

LEIGH SALES: The de facto asylum seeker policy in Australia at the moment is onshore processing which is the Greens policy. We're seeing the results of that policy, dozens of boats coming to Australia, boats sinking at sea, people dying, how many boats will have to sink before the Greens reconsider their position on this?

CHRISTINE MILNE: Well, that's a really offensive question because the Greens have always supported a safe pathway for refugees coming to Australia and the real question that you need to be asking is it that we want to save people's lives and provide safe pathways?

If that's the case then we would lift our humanitarian intake, then we would actually support the UNHCR financially in Indonesia to be able to process people more quickly.

LEIGH SALES: Okay, thank you, thank you, I'll decide what questions to ask and I want to ask you if you agree with me that onshore processing does not discourage people from coming to Australia on boats?

CHRISTINE MILNE: Well the question is do you want to encourage people to come to Australia? Do you want to welcome asylum seekers in this country?

LEIGH SALES: That actually wasn't the question, the question was does onshore processing encourage people to come to Australia and make these dangerous voyages via boat?

CHRISTINE MILNE: People are desperate to seek refuge and asylum in Australia. Our job is to provide safe pathways and we can do that that would discourage people from taking dangerous boat journeys if we introduced appropriate support through the UNHCR and increased our humanitarian intake so that people in camps understood there was actually a way of them safely coming to Australia.

But you're not going to dissuade desperate people from seeking asylum. What we want to do is make sure that safety of life at sea is prioritised, that we support the UNHCR, that we increase the humanitarian intake and that's why I take some hope from Tony Abbott saying today that he would support a multiparty process, that he would actually deal with this issue in some kind of cooperative way instead of as he has up until date and that's oppose it.

LEIGH SALES: Well as you point out Tony Abbott has given some ground today. Everyone in the Parliament seems to have been willing to make a compromise today except the Greens, why do you refuse to budge an inch?

CHRISTINE MILNE: The issue is do we want to act within the law. The law ought to be the fundamental way we proceed because we need to give leadership in the region and why would any other country in the region actually sign up to the refugee convention if Australia, one of the wealthiest countries in the region says we won't adhere to international law, that's why the High Court overthrew the Malaysia proposal.

LEIGH SALES: You can talk about the vagaries of international law and UN conventions but as you discuss that people are dying.

CHRISTINE MILNE: Yes and that’s why it would be a very good thing to increase our humanitarian intake, provide safer pathways, actually approach a regional solution and we've proposed a multiparty committee to work with the Prime Minister and the Leader of the Opposition providing it's in the context of international law and that really ought to be the basis.

LEIGH SALES: But that is not going to happen, it's clear that the other parties won't support that. Isn't this like the emissions trading scheme where you're saying well nothing is better than us having to give any ground whatsoever.

CHRISTINE MILNE: Well what's interesting is there has been kneejerk reaction today. A frenzy of debate which actually doesn’t provide a long-term solution because it doesn't provide anything that can't be struck down in the courts because it doesn't actually fit with helping people who are desperate to a better life.

Now the Greens have a view that we should live up to our obligations, help vulnerable people. Unfortunately other people want to deter asylum seekers and the whole debate has been how to send them somewhere else, out of sight out of mind. Our process says let's actually increase our humanitarian intake, let's support them to come to this country when they land here seeking asylum.

LEIGH SALES: Alright let me just update our audience. The House of Representatives has now voted on the Wilkie amendment to the bill and as expected it has gotten through.

Christine Milne, the Secretary of the Immigration Department Andrew Metcalf says the Malaysia solution provides the best deterrent, why won't you accept their advice?

CHRISTINE MILNE: So the question is are we actually seeking a deterrent, that's the key thing here. Do we want to uphold our obligations and actually welcome people seeking asylum or is the whole basis of this out of sight, out of mind, we don't want to take asylum seekers in Australia. Now the Greens say we should take asylum seeker, we ought to opening up this country to the prospect of an increased humanitarian intake and actually do the right thing.

LEIGH SALES: Sorry to keep interrupting but what you're talking about is so far removed from the reality of the actual debate today and what is going on today which is people are repeatedly boarding these boats trying to come to Australia for onshore processing and are losing their lives.

CHRISTINE MILNE: Well people kept boarding the boats after John Howard introduced the most appalling Pacific solution, the Sieve X went down after he introduced the temporary protection visas and if we had spent the billions that John Howard wasted on the Pacific solution actually supporting Indonesia and people in our region to appropriately process and look after asylum seekers we wouldn't be in the mess that we are in today. The issue here is we have to determine what is our objective and our objective ought to be to help people to save lives, to give people safer pathways to Australia.

LEIGH SALES: On the UN convention on refugees, Afghanistan's a signatory, Iran's a signatory, these are the countries that people are actually fleeing from to try to get refuge elsewhere. Why are you putting so much faith in this UN piece of paper?

CHRISTINE MILNE: Because I actually believe in international law. I think the only way we're going to get a regional solution is to actually uphold the law ourselves and actually encourage others to do so. The whole purpose of a refugee convention is to say that when someone seeks asylum in your country you have an obligation to actually look after them and that is something that Australia has to come to terms with and if that's not what people want they should be honest about it because we know how to save lives and we could be out there with stronger procedures for safety of life at sea, for example.

We could be out there increasing the humanitarian intake and we'll be moving in the Senate to actually get a message back to the House of Representatives to say now that Tony Abbott supports an increase in the humanitarian intake so do we so let's do it.

Now that Tony Abbott supports greater UNHCR support let's do it. Now that he actually wants a multiparty committee, great, let's do it. So we are willing to put our shoulders to the wheel and we want to do those things.

LEIGH SALES: Okay, Christine Milne, thank you for making time to speak to us tonight.

CHRISTINE MILNE: Thank you, Leigh.